On Tue, 18 Dec 2007 11:17:52 -0800 (PST), Koobee Wublee
wrote:

On Dec 17, 9:12 pm, nonsense wrote:
BURT wrote:

The magnetosphere of the earth acts as a force field shield
deflecting dangerous rays.

Tell us about cosmic rays.

Interstellar space is postulated to have a large quantity of very high-
energy particles known as cosmic rays. The solar wind form our sun
reduces the number of cosmic rays to a much lower level.

No.

The solar wind only significantly modulates cosmic rays whose energies
are in the MeV range. In the GeV range, the modulation decreases to
~20% and continues to drop as energy increases.

Do keep in mind that the MeV and GeV protons are a very small part of
the overall cosmic ray flux.

The earth's
magnetic field creates these Van Allen Belts which shields and traps
the solar wind and other harmful particles. Below the Van Allen
Belts, the radiation is about 10 RADs per year. It is not lethal but
considered health risk. The earth's atmosphere with the ionosphere
further attenuates the radiation level down to such benign level as
seen on the surface of the earth.

Not even ****ing close.

What amazes me is your constant almost-but-not-quite understanding of
physics. You don't know any of the details, nor can you explain what
is actually going on, but you almost always know enough of the words
to somewhat piece together what is going on.

It's too bad you are too arrogant to actually pick up a book to fill
in the details. Or maybe you tried and simply couldn't hack the math.

The magnetic field of the Earth is what sheilds the planet from the
solar wind. Nothing else. Most certainly not the Van Allen belts.

The Van Allen belts are an artifact of the planetary magnetic field
being imbedded in the solar wind. There is a mechanism that allows the
particles to make the transition from the far magnetotail into the
current sheet formed by the opposing magnetic field lines. From there,
another mechanism has a chance of jetting some plasma from the area in
which it collects up towards the planet. There, the plasma is kept in
what is known as the Van Allen belts.

Let's see if you learned anything. I can answer these - can you?

#1: Can you explain what the mechanism allows the particles traveling
nearly parallel to the field lines with temperatures in the range of a
million degrees Kelvin to jump across the magnetopause and start
collecting at the current sheet?

#2: Why is there a current sheet?

#3: Why is the particle population trapped? No, the answer is NOT
"they are in orbit". This is true, but it is not the whole answer.


How did the Apollo astronauts survive the radiation form solar wind
and cosmic rays without the protected environment of the Van Allen
Belts? They probably will survive with minimal shielding in the
command module for a week and a half, but coming back on earth, they
should be very ill and eventually demise in a few months.


Oh that's right, I forgot you are an Apollo denier.

The Van Allen belt extends out only a few Earth radii. The Apollo
craft passed through it in short order. What's 10 rad/yr over a week?

nonsense wrote:

Paul Hovnanian P.E. wrote:

BURT wrote:

The the magnetosphere of the earth acts as a force field shield
deflecting dangerous rays.
What more does magnetism do that is important to mankind?


It tells you which way north is.

It spins the blenders which make all of those mixed drinks that many of
the regulars of these newsgroups undoubtedly consume.

I don't think very many engage in the niceties;
the seem to prefer straight up right out of the
bottle.

And, most significantly, it sticks notes and the drawings of 6 year-olds
to the front of your refrigerator.

That's where I keep my bills, in calendar order. I've
given some thought to drawing the matrix with indelible
marker, but the numbers jump around from month to
month.

You draw the calendar and start day 1 at the upper left hand of the
matrix. Move the weekday names (on magnetic labels to the top of each
column as required each month).

--
Paul Hovnanian
------------------------------------------------------------------
Life is like a buffet. Its not very good but there's plenty of it.

On Dec 19, 6:12 pm, Eric Gisse wrote:
On Tue, 18 Dec 2007, Koobee Wublee wrote:

Interstellar space is postulated to have a large quantity of very high-
energy particles known as cosmic rays. The solar wind form our sun
reduces the number of cosmic rays to a much lower level.

No.

Yes.

The solar wind only significantly modulates cosmic rays whose energies
are in the MeV range. In the GeV range, the modulation decreases to
~20% and continues to drop as energy increases.

That is a good one. The solar wind modulates the cosmic rays.

Do keep in mind that the MeV and GeV protons are a very small part of
the overall cosmic ray flux.

shrug

The earth's
magnetic field creates these Van Allen Belts which shields and traps
the solar wind and other harmful particles. Below the Van Allen
Belts, the radiation is about 10 RADs per year. It is not lethal but
considered health risk. The earth's atmosphere with the ionosphere
further attenuates the radiation level down to such benign level as
seen on the surface of the earth.

Not even ****ing close.

What amazes me is your constant almost-but-not-quite understanding of
physics. You don't know any of the details, nor can you explain what
is actually going on, but you almost always know enough of the words
to somewhat piece together what is going on.

It's too bad you are too arrogant to actually pick up a book to fill
in the details. Or maybe you tried and simply couldn't hack the math.

The magnetic field of the Earth is what sheilds the planet from the
solar wind. Nothing else. Most certainly not the Van Allen belts.

Well, the Van Allen Belts are manifestations of the magnetic field
generated by the earth. This means the Van Allen Belts are part of
the magnetic field generated by the earth. So, your objection
although correct is very much personal.

Oh that's right, I forgot you are an Apollo denier.

It is good to deny lies. shrug

The Van Allen belt extends out only a few Earth radii. The Apollo
craft passed through it in short order.

Yes, this is correct.

What's 10 rad/yr over a week?

Do you not forget the Apollo missions go right to the moon unless they
stayed within the benign environment of the low earth orbit (below the
Van Allen Belts)? If so, they would enjoy only 10 RADs per year over
a week and a half. Do you want to try this one again assuming they
did spend a week and a half outside of the Van Allen Belts?

On Dec 19, 11:24 pm, Koobee Wublee wrote:
On Dec 19, 6:12 pm, Eric Gisse wrote:

On Tue, 18 Dec 2007, Koobee Wublee wrote:
Interstellar space is postulated to have a large quantity of very high-
energy particles known as cosmic rays. The solar wind form our sun
reduces the number of cosmic rays to a much lower level.

No.

Yes.

The solar wind only significantly modulates cosmic rays whose energies
are in the MeV range. In the GeV range, the modulation decreases to
~20% and continues to drop as energy increases.

That is a good one. The solar wind modulates the cosmic rays.

I can provide references if you'd bother reading them.


Do keep in mind that the MeV and GeV protons are a very small part of
the overall cosmic ray flux.

shrug



The earth's
magnetic field creates these Van Allen Belts which shields and traps
the solar wind and other harmful particles. Below the Van Allen
Belts, the radiation is about 10 RADs per year. It is not lethal but
considered health risk. The earth's atmosphere with the ionosphere
further attenuates the radiation level down to such benign level as
seen on the surface of the earth.

Not even ****ing close.

What amazes me is your constant almost-but-not-quite understanding of
physics. You don't know any of the details, nor can you explain what
is actually going on, but you almost always know enough of the words
to somewhat piece together what is going on.

It's too bad you are too arrogant to actually pick up a book to fill
in the details. Or maybe you tried and simply couldn't hack the math.

The magnetic field of the Earth is what sheilds the planet from the
solar wind. Nothing else. Most certainly not the Van Allen belts.

Well, the Van Allen Belts are manifestations of the magnetic field
generated by the earth. This means the Van Allen Belts are part of
the magnetic field generated by the earth. So, your objection
although correct is very much personal.

No, the Van Allen belt is NOT a part of the magnetic field. It is a
trapped particle population that is fed by the solar wind.

I already explained the what and why of the belt, but you snipped it
and repeated your misconceptions.


Oh that's right, I forgot you are an Apollo denier.

It is good to deny lies. shrug

The Van Allen belt extends out only a few Earth radii. The Apollo
craft passed through it in short order.

Yes, this is correct.

What's 10 rad/yr over a week?

Do you not forget the Apollo missions go right to the moon unless they
stayed within the benign environment of the low earth orbit (below the
Van Allen Belts)? If so, they would enjoy only 10 RADs per year over
a week and a half. Do you want to try this one again assuming they
did spend a week and a half outside of the Van Allen Belts?

"How did the Apollo astronauts survive the radiation form solar wind
and cosmic rays without the protected environment of the Van Allen
Belts?"

You are horribly, horribly confused.

Eric Gisse wrote:
On Dec 19, 11:24 pm, Koobee Wublee wrote:

snip

Do you not forget the Apollo missions go right to the moon unless they
stayed within the benign environment of the low earth orbit (below the
Van Allen Belts)? If so, they would enjoy only 10 RADs per year over
a week and a half. Do you want to try this one again assuming they
did spend a week and a half outside of the Van Allen Belts?

"How did the Apollo astronauts survive the radiation form solar wind
and cosmic rays without the protected environment of the Van Allen
Belts?"

You are horribly, horribly confused.

Probably drives on the same roads the rest of us use.
I guess I'd better stop complaining about insurance
rates.

On Dec 20, 3:24 am, Koobee Wublee wrote:
On Dec 19, 6:12 pm, Eric Gisse wrote:

On Tue, 18 Dec 2007, Koobee Wublee wrote:
Interstellar space is postulated to have a large quantity of very high-
energy particles known as cosmic rays. The solar wind form our sun
reduces the number of cosmic rays to a much lower level.

No.

Yes.

The solar wind only significantly modulates cosmic rays whose energies
are in the MeV range. In the GeV range, the modulation decreases to
~20% and continues to drop as energy increases.

That is a good one. The solar wind modulates the cosmic rays.

Do keep in mind that the MeV and GeV protons are a very small part of
the overall cosmic ray flux.

shrug



The earth's
magnetic field creates these Van Allen Belts which shields and traps
the solar wind and other harmful particles. Below the Van Allen
Belts, the radiation is about 10 RADs per year. It is not lethal but
considered health risk. The earth's atmosphere with the ionosphere
further attenuates the radiation level down to such benign level as
seen on the surface of the earth.

Not even ****ing close.

What amazes me is your constant almost-but-not-quite understanding of
physics. You don't know any of the details, nor can you explain what
is actually going on, but you almost always know enough of the words
to somewhat piece together what is going on.

It's too bad you are too arrogant to actually pick up a book to fill
in the details. Or maybe you tried and simply couldn't hack the math.

The magnetic field of the Earth is what sheilds the planet from the
solar wind. Nothing else. Most certainly not the Van Allen belts.

Well, the Van Allen Belts are manifestations of the magnetic field
generated by the earth. This means the Van Allen Belts are part of
the magnetic field generated by the earth. So, your objection
although correct is very much personal.

Are these iron filings part of the magnetic field of the bar magnet?

http://www.school-for-champions.com/..._detection.htm

Is a compass part of the magnetic field of the earth?

Oh that's right, I forgot you are an Apollo denier.

It is good to deny lies. shrug

The Van Allen belt extends out only a few Earth radii. The Apollo
craft passed through it in short order.

Yes, this is correct.

What's 10 rad/yr over a week?

Do you not forget the Apollo missions go right to the moon unless they
stayed within the benign environment of the low earth orbit (below the
Van Allen Belts)? If so, they would enjoy only 10 RADs per year over
a week and a half.

Since 1-1/2 weeks is 0.0288 yr, that works out to
0.288 Rad, assuming your numbers are correct.

That seems to be about the order of magnitude measured by
NASA closer to the moon:

http://lsda.jsc.nasa.gov/books/apollo/S2ch3.htm

About 1 mrad per hour, which is on the order of 8-10 Rad/year.

- Randy

On Dec 20, Randy Poe wrote:
On Dec 20, Koobee Wublee wrote:

Confused about what?

The standard line from the "we never went to the moon
crowd" is supposed to be "How did the Apollo astronauts
survive the terrible radiation of the Van Allen Belts?", that's
what you're confused about. Go back and read your
conspiracy tracts again.

No, these are your conspiracy theories. However, traversing through
the Van Allen Belts, you will be blinded.

Well, the Van Allen Belts are manifestations of the magnetic field
generated by the earth. This means the Van Allen Belts are part of
the magnetic field generated by the earth. So, your objection
although correct is very much personal.

Are these iron filings part of the magnetic field of the bar magnet?

You tell me.

http://www.school-for-champions.com/..._detection.htm

Is a compass part of the magnetic field of the earth?

What do you think?

Do you not forget the Apollo missions go right to the moon unless they
stayed within the benign environment of the low earth orbit (below the
Van Allen Belts)? If so, they would enjoy only 10 RADs per year over
a week and a half.

Since 1-1/2 weeks is 0.0288 yr, that works out to
0.288 Rad, assuming your numbers are correct.

According to the NASA report, TN D-7080 - Apollo Experience Report -
Protection Against Radiation, each astronaut received a radiation
dosage between 0.16 to 1.14 RADs. This is consistent with the
radiation in the low earth orbit or below the Van Allen Belts.

That seems to be about the order of magnitude measured by
NASA closer to the moon:

http://lsda.jsc.nasa.gov/books/apollo/S2ch3.htm

About 1 mrad per hour, which is on the order of 8-10 Rad/year.

That is from the Cosmic Ray only. shrug

On Dec 20, 2:13 pm, Koobee Wublee wrote:
On Dec 20, Randy Poe wrote:

On Dec 20, Koobee Wublee wrote:
Confused about what?

The standard line from the "we never went to the moon
crowd" is supposed to be "How did the Apollo astronauts
survive the terrible radiation of the Van Allen Belts?", that's
what you're confused about. Go back and read your
conspiracy tracts again.

No, these are your conspiracy theories. However, traversing through
the Van Allen Belts, you will be blinded.

Well, the Van Allen Belts are manifestations of the magnetic field
generated by the earth. This means the Van Allen Belts are part of
the magnetic field generated by the earth. So, your objection
although correct is very much personal.

Are these iron filings part of the magnetic field of the bar magnet?

You tell me.

No, they are pieces of iron. A magnetic field is not made
of iron.


http://www.school-for-champions.com/..._detection.htm

Is a compass part of the magnetic field of the earth?

What do you think?

No, it is an instrument which is influenced by the magnetic
field. It is not part of the magnetic field.

A sail is not part of the wind.

A nail is not part of a hammer.

A scale is not part of your weight.

These distinctions are not "technicalities".


Do you not forget the Apollo missions go right to the moon unless they
stayed within the benign environment of the low earth orbit (below the
Van Allen Belts)? If so, they would enjoy only 10 RADs per year over
a week and a half.

Since 1-1/2 weeks is 0.0288 yr, that works out to
0.288 Rad, assuming your numbers are correct.

According to the NASA report, TN D-7080 - Apollo Experience Report -
Protection Against Radiation, each astronaut received a radiation
dosage between 0.16 to 1.14 RADs. This is consistent with the
radiation in the low earth orbit or below the Van Allen Belts.

And the radiation in deep space and on the lunar surface.

That seems to be about the order of magnitude measured by
NASA closer to the moon:

http://lsda.jsc.nasa.gov/books/apollo/S2ch3.htm

About 1 mrad per hour, which is on the order of 8-10 Rad/year.

That is from the Cosmic Ray only. shrug

What do you believe the exposure near the moon to
be, and based on what?

- Randy

"Randy Poe" wrote in message
...
: On Dec 20, 2:13 pm, Koobee Wublee wrote:
: On Dec 20, Randy Poe wrote:
:
: On Dec 20, Koobee Wublee wrote:
: Confused about what?
:
: The standard line from the "we never went to the moon
: crowd" is supposed to be "How did the Apollo astronauts
: survive the terrible radiation of the Van Allen Belts?", that's
: what you're confused about. Go back and read your
: conspiracy tracts again.
:
: No, these are your conspiracy theories. However, traversing through
: the Van Allen Belts, you will be blinded.
:
: Well, the Van Allen Belts are manifestations of the magnetic field
: generated by the earth. This means the Van Allen Belts are part of
: the magnetic field generated by the earth. So, your objection
: although correct is very much personal.
:
: Are these iron filings part of the magnetic field of the bar magnet?
:
: You tell me.
:
: No, they are pieces of iron. A magnetic field is not made
: of iron.
:
:
: http://www.school-for-champions.com/..._detection.htm
:
: Is a compass part of the magnetic field of the earth?
:
: What do you think?
:
: No, it is an instrument which is influenced by the magnetic
: field. It is not part of the magnetic field.
:
: A sail is not part of the wind.
:
: A nail is not part of a hammer.
:
: A scale is not part of your weight.
:
A breakfast is not a walk on the Moon.
A fart is not a diamond.
A tree is not a joke.

: These distinctions are not "technicalities".

A Poe can't say what things are but is very good at saying what they are
not.
A Poe is not intelligent enough to know what things are.

On Dec 20, 11:26 am, Randy Poe wrote:
On Dec 20, 2:13 pm, Koobee Wublee wrote:

You tell me.

No, they are pieces of iron. A magnetic field is not made
of iron.

OK. shrug

What do you think?

No, it is an instrument which is influenced by the magnetic
field. It is not part of the magnetic field.

Once again, OK. shrug

A sail is not part of the wind.

A nail is not part of a hammer.

A scale is not part of your weight.

These distinctions are not "technicalities".

It is getting rather old.

According to the NASA report, TN D-7080 - Apollo Experience Report -
Protection Against Radiation, each astronaut received a radiation
dosage between 0.16 to 1.14 RADs. This is consistent with the
radiation in the low earth orbit or below the Van Allen Belts.

And the radiation in deep space and on the lunar surface.

This level of radiation is not what deep space craft or geosynchronous
satellites are designed for. shrug

That is from the Cosmic Ray only. shrug

What do you believe the exposure near the moon to
be, and based on what?

Try 300,000 RADs per year. Remember that the command capsule has a
shield of 0.3g/cm^2.