A Physics forum. Physics Banter

If this is your first visit, be sure to check out the FAQ by clicking the link above. You may have to register before you can post: click the register link above to proceed. To start viewing messages, select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below.

Go Back   Home » Physics Banter forum » Physics Newsgroups » The Theory of Relativity
Site Map Home Register Authors List Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read Web Partners

Tags: , ,

Question about the directional derivative



 
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old December 28th 04 posted to sci.physics.relativity
Amantine
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 4
Default Question about the directional derivative

MTW defines the directional derivative of a vector along a parametrized
curve as:

lim(e-0) (v(e)-v(0))/e (page 209)

The problem is that the size of the resulting vector depends on your
parametrization of the curve. If you multiply your affine parameter with
a certain number, the size of your directional derivative vector also
changes. My question is: shouldn't there be some kind of correction for
the parametrization of the curve, like making the tangent vector of the
curve an unit vector? Mathworld
(http://mathworld.wolfram.com/DirectionalDerivative.html) says you have
to use an unit vector, but I couldn't find that in MTW.

Amantine
Ads
  #2  
Old December 28th 04 posted to sci.physics.relativity
Tom Roberts
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 3,981
Default Question about the directional derivative

Amantine wrote:
MTW defines the directional derivative of a vector along a parametrized
curve as:
lim(e-0) (v(e)-v(0))/e (page 209)
The problem is that the size of the resulting vector depends on your
parametrization of the curve.


Yes, this is inherent -- in physics such derivatives are dimensioned
numbers.


If you multiply your affine parameter with
a certain number, the size of your directional derivative vector also
changes. My question is: shouldn't there be some kind of correction for
the parametrization of the curve, like making the tangent vector of the
curve an unit vector?


No. Consider a timelike curve parameterized by proper time, and then
imagine a units change (e.g. seconds to minutes) -- the directional
derivitave wrt proper time MUST change in scale accordingly (the value
of X per second becomes 60*X per minute, where X depends on what you are
differentiating).


Mathworld
(http://mathworld.wolfram.com/DirectionalDerivative.html) says you have
to use an unit vector, but I couldn't find that in MTW.


That's a difference between math and physics: units.

But this is also a terminological quirk: the MTW definition is really a
derivative wrt the path parameter, not truly wrt a "direction". And a
direction is by convention represented by a unit vector.

So it all boils down to: "what do you want to do?", and different
authors answer that with similar but different answers.


Tom Roberts
 




Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Derivative Products of Form (df/dx)(dg/dx) in Physics 23: Time-Directional-Derivative OsherD Physics - General Discussion 1 February 2nd 06 03:37 PM
How can the first derivative with respect to time be proportional to the second derivative with respect to space, unless the dimensions are moving relative to one-another? jollyrogership@yahoo.com Physics - General Discussion 8 December 27th 05 01:36 AM
Question about derivative of the metric tensor co.georg@physik.uni-karlsruhe.de Current Physics Research (Moderated) 0 October 2nd 05 07:44 PM
Covariant Derivative question Flip Tomato Current Physics Research (Moderated) 5 August 17th 04 05:27 PM
Covariant derivative question sal The Theory of Relativity 5 July 16th 04 05:17 PM


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 07:53 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2008, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO 2.4.0
Copyright ©2004-2008 Physics Banter, part of the NewsgroupBanter project.
The comments are property of their posters.
Foro de informatica - Adult ADHD - Women's Health Forum - Personal Loans - Debt