wrote:
Space stretches and this is the cause of the light stretch.

What is your explanation?

Uniform stretch everywhere doesn't work.
This is why shells grow in spirals.

Take 3 towns,; A, B, and C.
B is 10 km north of A. C is 10 km
north of c.

Now double all the distances
in one unit time.

B is now 20 km north of A.
C is now 20 km north of B.

So what?

Well, B moved 10 klicks.
How far did C move? (Hint: B is now
where C used to be.)

Well, B moved 10 klicks. How far
did C move in equal time? What about
D, E, F.....all originally at 10 klick
intervals? Get the picture?

John

Looking at gravity when space stretches you see
that it only gets weaker at its center. The center of
gravity of more than one galaxy would be somewhere
in the space inbetween and the space inbetween
is stretching.

As the space stretches so do the light waves.

wrote:
Infinite universe Jim?
It had a beining and is expanding at a finite rate.
You can't get infinity out of that.

It would have to be infinite in the beginning.

John Sefton wrote:
wrote:
Space stretches and this is the cause of the light stretch.

What is your explanation?

Uniform stretch everywhere doesn't work.
This is why shells grow in spirals.

Take 3 towns,; A, B, and C.
B is 10 km north of A. C is 10 km
north of c.

Now double all the distances
in one unit time.

B is now 20 km north of A.
C is now 20 km north of B.

So what?

Well, B moved 10 klicks.
How far did C move? (Hint: B is now
where C used to be.)

Well, B moved 10 klicks. How far
did C move in equal time? What about
D, E, F.....all originally at 10 klick
intervals? Get the picture?

John

That's why the velocity of galaxies away from us is proportional to
their distance (until relativistic effects kick in, and their relative
velocity compared to us becomes ambiguous).

T Wake wrote:
wrote in message
ups.com...
Let me take the oportunity to use this post for which
it was orignally intended twake:

Ok, a novel approach for you.....

If a closed universe is expanding there is no edge.

Well, it depends how you use closed. The general cosmological use for a
"Closed Universe" is one which has a finite amount of expansion possible. It
is still infinite in size.

If the universe is anything but infinite in size, it has an edge.

Instead the space inbetween the galaxies is stretching.

No. Stretching is a bad analogy as it implies things which aren't so.

The balloon model is not the real thing. It is an analogy to help people
understand some of the concepts.

What is interesting is that in cosmology the light
transversing this space is also stretched. It gets
longer and less energetic. This redshift is how we
determine their distances.

Where does the energy go?


If there is no boundary the universe can be seen to
be the surface of a hypersphere.


Nope.

Mitchell is right here about a finite universe not necessarily having a
boundary. This is the case if space has a positive curvature (assuming
it is isotropic and homogenous).

See, for example:
http://map.gsfc.nasa.gov/m_uni/uni_101bb2.html

Such a space is generally referred to as "closed." The
cold-dark-matter model of cosmology implied that if and only if there
was enough matter in space to make it closed, there was enough to make
it recollapse. However, the discovery of the accelerating expansion of
the universe indicated that there is more to the behavior of space-time
than the gravitational influence of ordinary and cold dark matter.
Thus, the statement that a closed universe must necessarily collapse is
no longer true, if you use "closed" in the usual way.

F is the distance from the gravity center of the atom to the center of
the atoms mass.

Dark energy is 0 wavelength at c.
Hubble constant at te edge 16 bly away the star goes away at c , thats
the egde of the Visible universe.
Past that is outside the universe invisible to us but with the
identical laws of physics.
Evry photon comes from a point that does not move in space or time
sooner or later evry photon will pass us at 0 wavelenth and at c.
BGR is the zone of the hubble constant visible ax.
But the photons from the entire universe pass this point with NO
wavelenth at c.
As a nuetron orbits at c , it takes up space per time unit. There is
an empty place in space as matter takes up space in motion.

allready too much for your heads.

"tj Frazir" wrote in message
...
Gibberish

Shut up you moron. Go away and play with the traffic.

Jim Black wrote:
John Sefton wrote:

wrote:

Space stretches and this is the cause of the light stretch.

What is your explanation?


Uniform stretch everywhere doesn't work.
This is why shells grow in spirals.

Take 3 towns,; A, B, and C.
B is 10 km north of A. C is 10 km
north of c.

Now double all the distances
in one unit time.

B is now 20 km north of A.
C is now 20 km north of B.

So what?

Well, B moved 10 klicks.
How far did C move? (Hint: B is now
where C used to be.)

Well, B moved 10 klicks. How far
did C move in equal time? What about
D, E, F.....all originally at 10 klick
intervals? Get the picture?

John


That's why the velocity of galaxies away from us is proportional to
their distance (until relativistic effects kick in, and their relative
velocity compared to us becomes ambiguous).

Which is fine if we are the center.
John

John Sefton wrote:
Jim Black wrote:
John Sefton wrote:

wrote:

Space stretches and this is the cause of the light stretch.

What is your explanation?


Uniform stretch everywhere doesn't work.
This is why shells grow in spirals.

Take 3 towns,; A, B, and C.
B is 10 km north of A. C is 10 km
north of c.

Now double all the distances
in one unit time.

B is now 20 km north of A.
C is now 20 km north of B.

So what?

Well, B moved 10 klicks.
How far did C move? (Hint: B is now
where C used to be.)

Well, B moved 10 klicks. How far
did C move in equal time? What about
D, E, F.....all originally at 10 klick
intervals? Get the picture?

John


That's why the velocity of galaxies away from us is proportional to
their distance (until relativistic effects kick in, and their relative
velocity compared to us becomes ambiguous).

Which is fine if we are the center.
John

Watch what happens if we simply change reference frames:

time
^
| * * * *
| * * * *
| * * * *
| * * * *
+------------------------ position

time
^
| * * * *
| * * * *
| * * * *
| * * * *
+------------------------ position

time
^
| * * * *
| * * * *
| * * * *
| * * * *
+------------------------ position

time
^
| * * * *
| * * * *
| * * * *
| * * * *
+------------------------ position

Every galaxy sees the other galaxies moving away from it at a rate
proportional to their distances.

But what about galaxies beyond the causal horizon? What are they
doing? Does NASA have a mission planned to go visit them? Mommy, will
Humanity ever live in peace?????????

- Donsky Oatsky, The Nut (Pecan) Ranch