Some defamers of Einstein wrongfully charge him with being a nitwit
pretender who stole his work from others. Einstein's own generation of
physicists did not believe that. How is this contradiction to be
resolved? Simple. The defamers are liars.

Below is a testimony from Niels Bohr about Einstein's huge
contributions to QM, including its philosophical import, found in

DISCUSSION WITH EINSTEIN ON EPISTEMOLOGICAL PROBLEMS IN ATOMIC
PHYSICS, p201--241, Albert Einstein, Philosopher-Scientist, Vol 1.


--- p201 ---


When invited by the Editor of the series, "Living Philosophers," to
write an article for this volume in which contemporary scientists are
honouring the epoch-making contributions of Albert Einstein to the
progress of natural philosophy and are acknowledging the indebtedness
of our whole generation for the guidance his GENIUS has given us, I
thought much of the best way of explaining how much I owe to him for
inspiration. In this connection, the many occasions through the years
on which I had the privilege to discuss with Einstein epistemological
problems raised by the modern development of atomic physics have come
back vividly to my mind and I have felt that I could hardly attempt
anything better than to give an account of these discussions which,
even if no complete concord has so far been obtained, have been of
greatest value and stimulus to me. I hope also that the account may
convey to wider circles an impression of how essential the open-minded
exchange of ideas has been for the progress in a field where new
experience has time after time demanded a reconsideration of our
views.

[emphasis mine]

Patrick

"Patrick Reany" wrote in message
om...
Some defamers of Einstein wrongfully charge him with being a nitwit
pretender who stole his work from others. Einstein's own generation of
physicists did not believe that. How is this contradiction to be
resolved? Simple. The defamers are liars.

Below is a testimony from Niels Bohr about Einstein's huge
contributions to QM, including its philosophical import, found in

DISCUSSION WITH EINSTEIN ON EPISTEMOLOGICAL PROBLEMS IN ATOMIC
PHYSICS, p201--241, Albert Einstein, Philosopher-Scientist, Vol 1.


--- p201 ---


When invited by the Editor of the series, "Living Philosophers," to
write an article for this volume in which contemporary scientists are
honouring the epoch-making contributions of Albert Einstein to the
progress of natural philosophy and are acknowledging the indebtedness
of our whole generation for the guidance his GENIUS has given us, I
thought much of the best way of explaining how much I owe to him for
inspiration. In this connection, the many occasions through the years
on which I had the privilege to discuss with Einstein epistemological
problems raised by the modern development of atomic physics have come
back vividly to my mind and I have felt that I could hardly attempt
anything better than to give an account of these discussions which,
even if no complete concord has so far been obtained, have been of
greatest value and stimulus to me. I hope also that the account may
convey to wider circles an impression of how essential the open-minded
exchange of ideas has been for the progress in a field where new
experience has time after time demanded a reconsideration of our
views.

[emphasis mine]

Patrick

If you read the letters that were exchanged between
Bohr and Einstein, and see the frustration that Bohr
had in trying to get Einstein to embrace quantum mechanics,
you would consider that Bohr might have been using sarcasm.

It appears that Bohr was eager to get Einstein to embrace Q.M.
including the Uncertainty Principle because Einstein was
an media icon, and was somewhat a drag on getting
Q.M. the respectability Bohr felt it should have.

As can be seen from the letters exchanged,
and the public comments of Bohr and Einstein,
Bohr was pushing Einstein, and Einstein was reacting
by responding when his reputation was at stake,
and ignoring Bohr's letters and challenges otherwise.

Bohr used several tactics in his effort to get Einstein
to embrace Q.M. He flattered him, gave him more credit
than he deserved in exposing the quantum aspect of nature,
and challenged him.

The bottom line is,
that Einstein was the media darling,
and thus influenced public opinion,
and Bohr was anxious to get him on the Copenhagen Q.M. team,
so that Bohr and the creators of Q.M. would get the attention
and respect they deserved.

Of course, it could be that Bohr really wanted Einstein
to reject Q.M. (So that Bohr and his team would be recognized
by future generations as the founders of the new physics.)
so he manipulated him into becoming an adversary.

--
Tom Potter http://tompotter.us

Tom Potter wrote:


"Patrick Reany" wrote in message
om...
Some defamers of Einstein wrongfully charge him with being a
nitwit pretender who stole his work from others. Einstein's
own generation of physicists did not believe that. How is this
contradiction to be resolved? Simple. The defamers are liars.

Below is a testimony from Niels Bohr about Einstein's huge
contributions to QM, including its philosophical import, found
in

DISCUSSION WITH EINSTEIN ON EPISTEMOLOGICAL PROBLEMS IN ATOMIC
PHYSICS, p201--241, Albert Einstein, Philosopher-Scientist,
Vol 1.


--- p201 ---


When invited by the Editor of the series, "Living
Philosophers," to write an article for this volume in which
contemporary scientists are honouring the epoch-making
contributions of Albert Einstein to the progress of natural
philosophy and are acknowledging the indebtedness of our whole
generation for the guidance his GENIUS has given us, I thought
much of the best way of explaining how much I owe to him for
inspiration. In this connection, the many occasions through
the years on which I had the privilege to discuss with
Einstein epistemological problems raised by the modern
development of atomic physics have come back vividly to my
mind and I have felt that I could hardly attempt anything
better than to give an account of these discussions which,
even if no complete concord has so far been obtained, have
been of greatest value and stimulus to me. I hope also that
the account may convey to wider circles an impression of how
essential the open-minded exchange of ideas has been for the
progress in a field where new experience has time after time
demanded a reconsideration of our views.

[emphasis mine]

Patrick

If you read the letters that were exchanged between
Bohr and Einstein, and see the frustration that Bohr
had in trying to get Einstein to embrace quantum mechanics,
you would consider that Bohr might have been using sarcasm.

It appears that Bohr was eager to get Einstein to embrace Q.M.
including the Uncertainty Principle because Einstein was
an media icon, and was somewhat a drag on getting
Q.M. the respectability Bohr felt it should have.

As can be seen from the letters exchanged,
and the public comments of Bohr and Einstein,
Bohr was pushing Einstein, and Einstein was reacting
by responding when his reputation was at stake,
and ignoring Bohr's letters and challenges otherwise.

Bohr used several tactics in his effort to get Einstein
to embrace Q.M. He flattered him, gave him more credit
than he deserved in exposing the quantum aspect of nature,
and challenged him.

The bottom line is,
that Einstein was the media darling,
and thus influenced public opinion,
and Bohr was anxious to get him on the Copenhagen Q.M. team,
so that Bohr and the creators of Q.M. would get the attention
and respect they deserved.

Of course, it could be that Bohr really wanted Einstein
to reject Q.M. (So that Bohr and his team would be recognized
by future generations as the founders of the new physics.)
so he manipulated him into becoming an adversary.

--
Tom Potter http://tompotter.us

Typical conspiracy thinking.

Einstein was the number two man in getting QM started, after Max
Planck. Planck worked out the correct formula for black bady
radiation from the assumption that light is emitted in packets
with wavelength proportional to energy (photons). Einstein
explained the photoelectric effect by showing that all the
phenomena followed from the assumption that light is absorbed in
such packets.

Bohr made his reputation by showing that photons plus atamic
energy levels could explain the spectrum of hydrogen. Einstein
had no problem with that. The problem came with the Heisenberg
indeterminacy principle. Heisenberg pointed out, among other
things, that Fourier analysis of a wave packet shows that
position and frequency cannot simultaneously be definite bolew a
certain limit. This fact is inherent to waves, and is not a
special feature of QM.

Einstein objected, and published his objections in the form of
thought experiments and arguments about the effect on
epistemology. Each ofjection was answered, frequently by
carrying out the experiment and showing that the
counterintuitive results predicted by Einstein were real, After
each setback, Einstein tried again. This went on for years.

It is this process that Bohr refers to. Einstein was never happy
with the Heisenberg principle. But he remains the genius of
Special and General Relativity, Brownian Motion, and the
Photoelectric Effect, and the well-deserved winner of the Nobel
Prize. He should have won at least twice, and perhaps three
times.
--
Edward Cherlin, Simputer Evangelist
Encore Technologies (S) Pte. Ltd.
Computers for all of us
http://www.simputerland.com, http://cherlin.blogspot.com

"Edward Cherlin" wrote in message
. ..
Tom Potter wrote:


"Patrick Reany" wrote in message
om...
Some defamers of Einstein wrongfully charge him with being a
nitwit pretender who stole his work from others. Einstein's
own generation of physicists did not believe that. How is this
contradiction to be resolved? Simple. The defamers are liars.

Below is a testimony from Niels Bohr about Einstein's huge
contributions to QM, including its philosophical import, found
in

DISCUSSION WITH EINSTEIN ON EPISTEMOLOGICAL PROBLEMS IN ATOMIC
PHYSICS, p201--241, Albert Einstein, Philosopher-Scientist,
Vol 1.


--- p201 ---


When invited by the Editor of the series, "Living
Philosophers," to write an article for this volume in which
contemporary scientists are honouring the epoch-making
contributions of Albert Einstein to the progress of natural
philosophy and are acknowledging the indebtedness of our whole
generation for the guidance his GENIUS has given us, I thought
much of the best way of explaining how much I owe to him for
inspiration. In this connection, the many occasions through
the years on which I had the privilege to discuss with
Einstein epistemological problems raised by the modern
development of atomic physics have come back vividly to my
mind and I have felt that I could hardly attempt anything
better than to give an account of these discussions which,
even if no complete concord has so far been obtained, have
been of greatest value and stimulus to me. I hope also that
the account may convey to wider circles an impression of how
essential the open-minded exchange of ideas has been for the
progress in a field where new experience has time after time
demanded a reconsideration of our views.

[emphasis mine]

Patrick

If you read the letters that were exchanged between
Bohr and Einstein, and see the frustration that Bohr
had in trying to get Einstein to embrace quantum mechanics,
you would consider that Bohr might have been using sarcasm.

It appears that Bohr was eager to get Einstein to embrace Q.M.
including the Uncertainty Principle because Einstein was
an media icon, and was somewhat a drag on getting
Q.M. the respectability Bohr felt it should have.

As can be seen from the letters exchanged,
and the public comments of Bohr and Einstein,
Bohr was pushing Einstein, and Einstein was reacting
by responding when his reputation was at stake,
and ignoring Bohr's letters and challenges otherwise.

Bohr used several tactics in his effort to get Einstein
to embrace Q.M. He flattered him, gave him more credit
than he deserved in exposing the quantum aspect of nature,
and challenged him.

The bottom line is,
that Einstein was the media darling,
and thus influenced public opinion,
and Bohr was anxious to get him on the Copenhagen Q.M. team,
so that Bohr and the creators of Q.M. would get the attention
and respect they deserved.

Of course, it could be that Bohr really wanted Einstein
to reject Q.M. (So that Bohr and his team would be recognized
by future generations as the founders of the new physics.)
so he manipulated him into becoming an adversary.

--
Tom Potter http://tompotter.us

Typical conspiracy thinking.

Einstein was the number two man in getting QM started, after Max
Planck. Planck worked out the correct formula for black bady
radiation from the assumption that light is emitted in packets
with wavelength proportional to energy (photons). Einstein
explained the photoelectric effect by showing that all the
phenomena followed from the assumption that light is absorbed in
such packets.

Bohr made his reputation by showing that photons plus atamic
energy levels could explain the spectrum of hydrogen. Einstein
had no problem with that. The problem came with the Heisenberg
indeterminacy principle. Heisenberg pointed out, among other
things, that Fourier analysis of a wave packet shows that
position and frequency cannot simultaneously be definite bolew a
certain limit. This fact is inherent to waves, and is not a
special feature of QM.

Einstein objected, and published his objections in the form of
thought experiments and arguments about the effect on
epistemology. Each ofjection was answered, frequently by
carrying out the experiment and showing that the
counterintuitive results predicted by Einstein were real, After
each setback, Einstein tried again. This went on for years.

It is this process that Bohr refers to. Einstein was never happy
with the Heisenberg principle. But he remains the genius of
Special and General Relativity, Brownian Motion, and the
Photoelectric Effect, and the well-deserved winner of the Nobel
Prize. He should have won at least twice, and perhaps three
times.
--
Edward Cherlin, Simputer Evangelist
Encore Technologies (S) Pte. Ltd.
Computers for all of us
http://www.simputerland.com, http://cherlin.blogspot.com

There is a book that contains many of the letters exchanged
between Bohr and Einstein, and I suggest that if you read the book,
you will see that Bohr was pressing Einstein to come over to Q.M.,
and Einstein was ignoring or parrying Bohr's probes.

The EPR paper by Einstein, Podolsky, and Rosen
is Einstein's most famous response to Bohr's efforts
to get him to embrace quantum mechanics.

It seems to me, that Einstein was reluctant to do this,
as it would enhance the reputation of Bohr and the
Q.M. physicists at the expense of his reputation.

In spite of the fact that his Brownian Motion and
photoelectric effect equations used Planck's Constant,
it is clear that Einstein held out as a believer that reality
was continuous, rather than discrete, and he made a
statement to the effect that his science was a house of cards
if nature was not continuous and differentiable.

Bohr and the Q.M. gang, tried to get Einstein on board,
by suggesting that his Brownian Motion and
photoelectric effect equations were central to Q.M.
whereas, in fact, the were not central.

--
Tom Potter http://tompotter.us